Rule #2: THE MIC IS ALWAYS HOT GODDAMMIT!
I cannot for the life of me understand why people always forget this–especially people who spend a great deal of their working lives in front of a microphone.
Honestly, I don’t know what the truth is. It’s certainly possible that Bernie said it. It’s also possible that Liz doesn’t remember it correctly. It’s also possible that the political media LOVES a bloodbath and will do whatever they can to keep this little shitstorm going for as long as possible.
The important thing is that the two of them need to put a lid on it–and their campaign staffs–because they need to focus on bringing down Uncle Joe first before taking the gloves off with each other.
The media definitely loves a bloodbath & the corporate media wants nothing more than to destroy both of these two candidates. Unfortunately to beat Joe, one of them will have to drop out or they will both split close to 30% & Joe will get 40%. I hate the term “electability” but if such a thing does exist I honestly don’t know which one has a better chance. I’m pretty sure both face a huge fight against the powers that be in both the DNC & corporate world.
We never know what “electability” meant until after the election. Every time. There is no way to measure it. As Warren pointed out, the women on that stage had won more elections. Women have been winning more since Trump took office. But I mean, does that mean Warren and Klob are more “electable” in this election? We don’t fucking know.
I think the election of Donald Trump proves that “electability” is an utterly meaningless concept. Trump wasn’t “electable”. At every stage of the republican primary, everyone was certain he wouldn’t go any further because the republican brass hated him/his unpredictable behavior made him a liability/his platform (such as it was) was a mess/he didn’t really want the job. And yet, here we are.
If I believed that the people who claimed we should all back Biden or Buttigieg because of their “electability” were being sincere, I’d say they were just as out of touch with reality as Trump supporters. However, I don’t think even they believe what they’re saying. I think they just don’t want to admit that they think poor people shouldn’t have access to healthcare or have to explain why they think the neoliberalization of higher education (and the associated debt that students have to carry) is a good thing.
“I think they just don’t want to admit that they think poor people shouldn’t have access to healthcare or have to explain why they think the neoliberalization of higher education (and the associated debt that students have to carry) is a good thing.”
This, and they still have an implicit white man leadership bias.
Hey, Hazy Jane, where’s Killer Joe, Wild Billy and Gee Man?
The irony is that the press will go to almost insane lengths to avoid reporting on what Trump says:
https://www.vox.com/2020/1/15/21066935/trump-milwaukee-rally-media-sanitizing-npr
He will launch long, incoherent tirades about dishwashers and lightbulbs in front of people screaming for Muslim blood, but it gets reported as “Trump challenged Democrats before an enthusiastic audience.”
and don’t forget that donnie is also putting out hits on our own ambassadors probably because their showers have more water pressure
It’s pretty astonishing at this point that these kinds of blunders keep happening. Even if you’re pretty sure your mic is off, somebody could be recording sound and/or video with a phone. And you know you’re on camera — some tabloid could pay someone to review the video and lip-read it. Just be on your best behavior in public, people!
::puts on tinfoil hat:: Honestly we are all carrying around a hot mic in our pockets and purses these days.
I have been refusing to engage with this fuckery so far. There have been HUGE fucking developments with HUGE implications for the entire world and our politics and impeachment and everything, and what would the media have us focus on? A cat fight between progressives? How convenient. #DemocratsInDisarrayWinsAgain
I believe Bernie said this. It’s a pretty easy thing to believe – a man says a thing that doesn’t seem sexist to him, feels sexist to woman who has been fighting sexism in her career and in this election. I think Bernie had a way out of this (say what he really means and apologize!) that would have made him look a little better and he hasn’t taken it.
HOWEVER I think this is being blown out of proportion, and I am REAL FUCKING NERVOUS seeing the #neverwarren shit. The only NEVER in this election needs to be fucking Trump.
That’s Bernie in a nutshell, though. He’s been accused of this sort of thing in the past, especially with regards to race, and rather than apologize and expand on what he means, he just shuts down. I believe Bernie isn’t racist or sexist, but he sure is bad about being confronted on the issue.
Yep. It’s when his out of touchness really comes into focus. I will be thrilled if I get to vote for him in the general, but I can barely interact with his diehards. It’s like, oh he’s in a spat with Warren, WE’RE GOING TO KILL HER SHE’S A CORPORATE SHILL SNAKE.
Jesus fucking christ people.
I said to a friend the other day that if he would just say the following, the whole thing might fade away: “I don’t recall saying that, but if I did, I would have been wrong, and I’m sorry.” The press would probably still try to distort it, but maybe it would at least be enough for Warren to let the matter drop so they can present a united front against Uncle Joe and Drumpf.
Yeah exactly! It would have disappeared by the time the debate started I bet.
I mean, that’s just it. Just say “I apologize wholeheartedly, it wasn’t my intention to denigrate Elizabeth in any way.”
Bernie’s refusal to apologise for…well, anything really, or change his stance or delivery, is the one thing about him that grinds my gears the most.
Yeah I agree. I am almost always in agreement with him but this particular habit really pisses me off.
“I believe Bernie said this. It’s a pretty easy thing to believe – a man says a thing that doesn’t seem sexist to him, feels sexist to woman who has been fighting sexism in her career and in this election. I think Bernie had a way out of this (say what he really means and apologize!) that would have made him look a little better and he hasn’t taken it.”
Thiiiiiissssssssss is what I’ve been saying from the start. I’m not even trying to be particularly mean to Bernie or call him an evil sexist or something. But a guy can say something that seems reasonable (even obvious) to him, and then kind of blithely forget he even said it because it was that unimportant to him. Meanwhile, to a woman, it has a much greater impact. (Particularly if that woman thought the man otherwise supported her.) I am NOT at all surprised that he thinks he “didn’t say it” (whatever it actually is), while she remembers it much more clearly.
On the flip side… yeah, sure. He could have said something relatively innocuous, that she took the wrong way. Quite possible. She’s human! They’re both human!
Unfortunately, it’s true that they’ve both been essentially calling each other liars. That’s where we are.
I’ve also been saying from the start that if what he actually said was along the lines of expressing concern that in 2020 — after 4 years of Trump inflaming misogyny everywhere, after the poisonous takes on Hillary’s loss* — a woman will have a harder time winning the election than he thought before… I don’t think he would be exactly wrong, either. I don’t fully agree that a woman “can’t” win (if that’s what he said), and clearly Warren didn’t either because she went ahead with running. But she also has to know how tough it will be if she gets the nom.
Then again, it’s going to be tough for Bernie if HE gets the nom. Never mind a woman running. The only other non-Protestant-Christian who’s ever run for president, and won, was JFK. If Bernie gets the nom, especially after the last few years, it’s going to get hugely ugly, and I hope we’re all prepared for that.
Yeah exactly – when this shit started, my first thought was, “I bet he forgot about it.”
I also assumed it was what you are saying – that he was pointing out what we are all worried about: that a woman can’t win because everyone’s a sexist. I’d argue people need to stop spewing that poison into the universe, but that’s still not nearly as bad as the worst takes. Either way, he should just be open to the idea that maybe he said something along those lines that hit Liz in a sensitive place (as it would lots of women).
Every mic is a hot mic is the same rule that they teach you at the gun range: every gun is a loaded gun.